Diskusjon om svartkruttskyting og gamle våpen
Started by Staffy, 18. September 2015 kl. 10:16:43
18. September 2015 kl. 10:16:43
It was many years ago that I found this Forum following seeing a Kammerlader for sale with a US dealer. It prompted me to read up on the topic, although the multiplicity of types was difficult. When Nic offered his for sale, see earlier post, and it was just a short distance away, it was difficult to pass up and an opportunity to do a bit of research.
As will be seen from the attached photos, it has been refurbished at some time, the rear barrel band is not original and it has a C19th Swiss sling.
Thanks to an introduction from PommyB to GKA who, with persistence and patience, sourced a trigger guard.
The following possibly is old hat to members but I trust it rounds off the details of this particular rifle.
It was issued to the Christiansandske (gevorbne) Musketer Corps 2. Compagnie. To the rear of the new rear sight is the mark of Maximilian Gran, as is also to the rear of the lever pivot. So it would have been test fired at a range of 200 alen into a 12"x 12" target, scoring 6 out of 10 shots.
As to the Belgian marks, although Auguste Francotte was the principal contractor, the nature of the Liege gunmaking business meant that parts were outsourced from specialist contractors, with Gilles Decourtis being the major subcontractor, his mark being on the underside of the action/receiver. The barrel shows typical Liege proof marks and what seems to be a badly struck Francotte mark with AR below. I have not been able to determine whose mark JP/46 is, which is on the lock, just to the front of the rear sling swivel and small p's on most other metal parts. Whoever it was must have been prolific as the mark is also on other Belgian rifles, including an Albini M1841/53/67/80 in my collection.
It is unfortunate there is not a great deal on the marks of the dispersed out-worker system employed at the time in Liege, even in books such as Claude Gaier's Cinq Siecles d Ármurerie Liegeoise'. however,
is in the process of filling some of the gaps.
My thanks to patrick.vandepoele, Belgian Armed Forces Museum and Gjermund Fjeld, Norwegian Armed Forces Museum for their kind help with my enquiries.
There is a report on the M1846 in Mathieu Willemsen's excellent book 'Experiment and Trial', pages 120/121
19. September 2015 kl. 5:39:00
Gongratulations with a nice piece of history, Staffy!
And thank you very much for a detailed history lesson :-)
Best regards, Tor
Best når det smeller!
21. September 2015 kl. 20:21:29
: 21. September 2015 kl. 20:29:33 by 22198
It's Nice to finally see the Pictures Alan,it's looking real good.
have you shot it yet?
There are a lot of experts here on the forum that has a lot of knowledge on theese rifles,jæger Justnæs is one of them:-)
Tidligere kjent som kruttlappen2
25. September 2015 kl. 22:22:34
Thanks Tor and Geir,
Regrettably Arthritis has curtailed my shooting activities, so she will be a show pony with me. For those interested in Belgian marks, the site
has useful information. In the trial by the Dutch, they were not enthusiastic about the M.1846.
Cheers, Staffy. Thanks for your help Geir.
28. November 2015 kl. 18:47:32
Dear Staffy I too have a G Decortis stamped , K L . It isn't as well marked and lacks the rear sight but though pitted its useable . I had to make a new stock having only the lock work and the barrel , Mine differs it has four screws holding down the rear plate . The underside is the square copper lined hole for the original sight there seems to be a great variety of them . I used the heavier bullet per Schons booklet I will make a cutter to enlarge a suitable mould . some shew a stem on the base and mention a disk / washer like? to fit the stem ,disk might mean a wad make more sense . I have a Swedish Navy one shorter heavy but larger than the size Shcoon mentions its about 600 cal . Again there seems many varients . All good fun though and interesting . Never knew facebook was so usefull . Best wishes, Regards Maurice
29. November 2015 kl. 3:29:53
Greetings from across the Tasman and trust you are watching the Test in our back yard.
My interest is in black powder breech loading rifles, particularly the muzzle loading examples.
However, my knowledge of Kammerladers is limited, so I trust other members of the forum can help you. A photo would assist in nailing down your piece, although there is good info on the internet if you want to delve deeper.
Members, such as Gier and PommyB (who has posted a video), have discussed various loadings for the rifle, which I'm sure will be helpful. My days on the range have long since gone, due to arthritis. Kind regards, Staffy.
p.s. I'm in need of a replacement stock for a Calisher & Terry carbine (1864) #7256 N.Z.916. How good is your whittling?;-) Cheers.
29. November 2015 kl. 3:32:29
Sorry, should read GEIR!! Apologies mate. Staffy
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